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#192732 - 06/01/18 11:43 PM Re: CAST BULLETS: HOW FAST IS TOO FAST? [Re: SGalan]
Reloder28
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Registered: 05/05/14
Posts: 71

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My 45 Colt load is 25 gr of I4227 with 250 XTPs. It clocks 1250 fps. It prints 1 hole ragged groups from the bench at 50 yards.

Ruger SBH Hunter 7.5
Burris FF1

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#199254 - 04/28/19 08:37 PM Re: CAST BULLETS: HOW FAST IS TOO FAST? [Re: Reloder28]
45MAN
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Registered: 08/13/17
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Loc: brownsville, texas

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CMNASH's RECENT BRAGGGING BOARD POST OF HIS 2 PIECE RECOVERED WFN "HISTORIC" CAST BULLET MADE ME THINK THAT GUYS NEED TO REVIEW THIS MOST INTERESTING TOPIC AGAIN.
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#199257 - 04/28/19 10:38 PM Re: CAST BULLETS: HOW FAST IS TOO FAST? [Re: 45MAN]
cmnash
old hand


Registered: 07/23/10
Posts: 1086
Loc: Clarkesville, GA

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 Originally Posted By: 45MAN
CMNASH's RECENT BRAGGGING BOARD POST OF HIS 2 PIECE RECOVERED WFN "HISTORIC" CAST BULLET MADE ME THINK THAT GUYS NEED TO REVIEW THIS MOST INTERESTING TOPIC AGAIN.



320 grain .44 loaded by Reeds Ammo to a claimed but unverified 1200 fps.

The bullet struck a 550 lb Highland bull low in the shoulder at about 30 yards. The base was recovered from the offside hide, while the nose fragment remained in the on side shoulder.

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#199316 - 04/30/19 12:20 PM Re: CAST BULLETS: HOW FAST IS TOO FAST? [Re: cmnash]
tradmark
Gun Slinger


Registered: 06/08/10
Posts: 2993

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That result is why we started the bovine bash. Now imagine trying to bring down a cape buff with that. There are much better bullets. Im sure an elk would die with that with your shooting matthew, but it might add alot to the pack out if you recover it. Id prefer it going down ?right now? than going down 800 more vertical feet to pack it up and out.

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#199320 - 04/30/19 12:43 PM Re: CAST BULLETS: HOW FAST IS TOO FAST? [Re: tradmark]
cmnash
old hand


Registered: 07/23/10
Posts: 1086
Loc: Clarkesville, GA

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 Originally Posted By: tradmark
That result is why we started the bovine bash. Now imagine trying to bring down a cape buff with that. There are much better bullets. Im sure an elk would die with that with your shooting matthew, but it might add alot to the pack out if you recover it. Id prefer it going down ?right now? than going down 800 more vertical feet to pack it up and out.


I concur. I carried that bullet to elk country last fall. If I had been able to close to sixgun distance, I might have placed one in a bull elk. I think now, that he might have very well walked my butt all over that country.

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#199322 - 04/30/19 01:36 PM Re: CAST BULLETS: HOW FAST IS TOO FAST? [Re: cmnash]
tradmark
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Posts: 2993

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Thats also why i get a kick out of the elite, usually western, hunters that criticize fences feeders, stands, etc. but mostly fenced exotic hunts. These serve a huge use besides hunting and fun, but ample opportunities to test and undo the horrible advice/dogmas of years gone by. I know more than one hunter that wishes they wouldve seen results from this hunt or the bovine bash before losing expensive animals and trophy fees.

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#199325 - 04/30/19 02:12 PM Re: CAST BULLETS: HOW FAST IS TOO FAST? [Re: Sawfish]
tradmark
Gun Slinger


Registered: 06/08/10
Posts: 2993

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 Originally Posted By: Sawfish
Some years ago John Linebaugh did a series of comparison tests with heavy weight cast bullets. He concluded that "...a dependable cast slug, not too hard, not too soft, at a moderate velocity not to exceed 1300 fps and let caliber and bullet weight do the job..." He went on to state that his preference was 1200 fps. I load between 1100 and 1200 fps, depending on caliber. I prefer 1100 fps in my 45/70 and 480 Ruger revolvers and 1200 fps in everything else.



This is the problem though. Linebaugh hasnt shot much and quite frankly doesnt know how bullets work or damage is done. This last year we compared 475 440 wfn?s with a huge meplat, the biggest in the business, shot at 1100 fps vs 357 mags with 140 gr barnes at 1450 fps and the 357 created a better wound channel. A revolver isnt just a punch press and the idea that that is the way to go is only touted by those that havent done much of it to begin with. Working on one or two animals doesnt make for a dogma worth adhering to. I shot a watusi, which is no cape buffalo, with a 440gr 500 smith at jrh velocities 1384 fps and it obviously lost its nose profile and took a 60 degree turn and exited the size of a pencil hole and the chase was on. When we caught up to them we couldnt even tell which one was the wounded one until my cousin picked up a trickle of blood in one of their nostrils. Put it down in 10 yards with a barnes xbp 250 out of a 454. According to the dogma its supposed to be the other way around, but its not.

I have a feeling theres alot of animals running around africa that were never recovered, but those stories are rarely told. I witnessed one of them. Rarely in the world of dangerous game hunting is a solid the best answer and ive yet to find a situation where a cast is.

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#199327 - 04/30/19 03:15 PM Re: CAST BULLETS: HOW FAST IS TOO FAST? [Re: tradmark]
Whitworth
Shootist


Registered: 01/15/09
Posts: 9644
Loc: Virginia

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 Originally Posted By: tradmark
 Originally Posted By: Sawfish
Some years ago John Linebaugh did a series of comparison tests with heavy weight cast bullets. He concluded that "...a dependable cast slug, not too hard, not too soft, at a moderate velocity not to exceed 1300 fps and let caliber and bullet weight do the job..." He went on to state that his preference was 1200 fps. I load between 1100 and 1200 fps, depending on caliber. I prefer 1100 fps in my 45/70 and 480 Ruger revolvers and 1200 fps in everything else.



This is the problem though. Linebaugh hasnt shot much and quite frankly doesnt know how bullets work or damage is done. This last year we compared 475 440 wfn?s with a huge meplat, the biggest in the business, shot at 1100 fps vs 357 mags with 140 gr barnes at 1450 fps and the 357 created a better wound channel. A revolver isnt just a punch press and the idea that that is the way to go is only touted by those that havent done much of it to begin with. Working on one or two animals doesnt make for a dogma worth adhering to. I shot a watusi, which is no cape buffalo, with a 440gr 500 smith at jrh velocities 1384 fps and it obviously lost its nose profile and took a 60 degree turn and exited the size of a pencil hole and the chase was on. When we caught up to them we couldnt even tell which one was the wounded one until my cousin picked up a trickle of blood in one of their nostrils. Put it down in 10 yards with a barnes xbp 250 out of a 454. According to the dogma its supposed to be the other way around, but its not.

I have a feeling theres alot of animals running around africa that were never recovered, but those stories are rarely told. I witnessed one of them. Rarely in the world of dangerous game hunting is a solid the best answer and ive yet to find a situation where a cast is.


Blasphemy!!!! Hahahahaha
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#199340 - 04/30/19 09:42 PM Re: CAST BULLETS: HOW FAST IS TOO FAST? [Re: tradmark]
racksmasher1
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Registered: 05/22/13
Posts: 1484
Loc: New York

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 Originally Posted By: tradmark
Thats also why i get a kick out of the elite, usually western, hunters that criticize fences feeders, stands, etc. but mostly fenced exotic hunts. These serve a huge use besides hunting and fun, but ample opportunities to test and undo the horrible advice/dogmas of years gone by. I know more than one hunter that wishes they wouldve seen results from this hunt or the bovine bash before losing expensive animals and trophy fees.
Well said

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#199352 - 05/01/19 12:01 PM Re: CAST BULLETS: HOW FAST IS TOO FAST? [Re: Whitworth]
Jeff460
member


Registered: 12/01/17
Posts: 199
Loc: Kansas

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Bullet-performance is the key. A good cast-bullet that penetrates through the vital living area of the animal will kill that animal. A heart-shot animal using a cast-bullet will die. If a cast-bullet deflects or looses its nose it is not going to kill predictably. A Punch bullet or Cutting Edge Bullet will hold together and penetrate like a good hard-cast bullet has shown it can also do. And an A-frame through the heart or through the skull will kill also. So I echo the Bond film and state clearly, live and let die. LOL


Edited by Jeff460 (05/01/19 12:03 PM)
Edit Reason: Clarification change

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