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#198314 - 03/26/19 07:03 AM Re: Cast or expanding for large big game??? [Re: sixshot]
45MAN
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Registered: 08/13/17
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FOR ME HERE ARE SOME MEGA-IMPORTANT KEYS TO BIG GAME HUNTING WITH REVOLVERS: 1) LARGE CALIBER (I MOSTLY USE 45 COLTS/454's), 2) BULLET INTEGRITY, WHICH ELIMINATES MOST CAST BULLETS PUSHED AT OR OVER 1,300fps, 3) A FLAT POINT OF APPROPRIATE WIDTH, AND 4) HIT 'EM IN THE SHOULDERS!!!! SO YOU MAXIMIZE SHOCK ON THE ANIMAL. I HAVE FOUND THAT TKO VALUES, USING APPROPRIATE BULLETS, IS A VERY GOOD INDICATOR OF REVOLVER KILLING POWER, SO PUSHING THE BULLET FASTER IS A PLUS.
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#198317 - 03/26/19 08:32 AM Re: Cast or expanding for large big game??? [Re: Raptortrapper]
Randy M
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Registered: 07/04/11
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Loc: New Braunfels, TX

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 Originally Posted By: Raptortrapper
 Originally Posted By: Randy M
Well, it?s about that time of year and we haven?t had one of these threads in awhile. Lol.


OOOOHHHH MAN!!!!! You should have seen the large vs magnum primer thread a few years back! It was one of those things that we don't even mention any more! To say the P word just in passing almost got ya exiled after that. It was seriously worse than politics!


Interesting. I certainly don't want to bring up a sore subject, but I'm actually interested in this topic. I've done my own tests with my 460 on large vs. magnum and had unexplainable results. The mags were consistently slower. Head scratcher.
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#198320 - 03/26/19 09:33 AM Re: Cast or expanding for large big game??? [Re: Raptortrapper]
NYhandgunner
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Registered: 03/02/19
Posts: 33

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I've always loaded one of John Linebaugh's pet loads in my 45c, 265 gr. with 24gr H110...but I've been looking to go heavier and I've been looking at the 335 WLN, what load do you use?

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#198321 - 03/26/19 10:02 AM Re: Cast or expanding for large big game??? [Re: NYhandgunner]
Raptortrapper
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Registered: 03/31/09
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Loc: Colorado

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My favorite is the 335gr WLNGC from Cast Performance. Use it with Titegroup for a light load, or with H110 for a full house load. It was very accurate either way.
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#198322 - 03/26/19 10:24 AM Re: Cast or expanding for large big game??? [Re: Vance in AK.]
karl
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Registered: 01/12/15
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Loc: Minnesota

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 Originally Posted By: Vance in AK.
but if i could find a heavy jacketed bullet that penetrated well but had some sharp edges to open things up just a bit i wouldn't mind a bit.


I can't speak about options for 44 mag or about the A-frame or deep curl (I think the A-frame looks like a great choice with the webbed jacket to ensure bullet integrity but have never used them) But I've had good luck with the Barnes bullets. I'm working up a load for my 454 right now with their 250gn bullet as a woods gun with. They are lighter then your typical lead bullet load, but you can (and should!) run them faster. The down side is bullet cost. I usually have a hunting load and practice load with similar ballistics.
In 45-70 with an Encore pistol they will literally knock big deer off their feet at 100 yards. In bullet testing they retain all their weight, penetrate very well and open up to ~2x their original diameter with sharp copper petals. In heart/lung shots I have seen entrance wounds in the lung tissue that look like a 2" broad head passed through. The exit wound is typically ~2" and in between it looks like blood sausage ready to be stuffed. I hope to try them this fall on an AK moose with a slightly.

I'm sure someone has done a youtube video comparing different 44mag loads in ballistics gel that you could find. While not directly translatable to live animals, it is a reasonable comparison between loads.

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#198323 - 03/26/19 12:02 PM Re: Cast or expanding for large big game??? [Re: Whitworth]
Jeff460
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Registered: 12/01/17
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Loc: Kansas

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Well stated friends. I agree that diameter is constant, especially with a Cutting Edge Bullet (CEB) of solid brass or copper or when using a Punch bullet. And accuracy is of paramount importance to hit the vitals with precision. Velocity is a constantly diminishing component, but rotations per minute imparted to the bullet by that velocity is relatively constant. This apparent "drill-effect" is still a useful component.
An A-frame through the lungs can be good for bleeding-out, or causing the injured lung cavity to fill-up with blood.
I have heard that a moose "hurts all over" when shot, but that it can take a while for the lungs to fill-up with blood. I have no first-hand knowledge though. You Whitworth have tremendous experience with handgun hunting, on the other hand.
Just keep posting the truth of your experiences and I will keep reading and reacting to the postings.


Edited by Jeff460 (03/26/19 01:22 PM)
Edit Reason: Clarification change

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#198325 - 03/26/19 02:02 PM Re: Cast or expanding for large big game??? [Re: Jeff460]
tradmark
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First you gotta decide what you are willing to pay. The best bullets arent cheap but neither are the game animals you hunt, nor are the guns you shoot em with. That said, for solids the solid copper and punch are the single kost reliable bullets you can shoot. A frames and some barnes are the best expandables you can get. I find the aframes personally the best. Somewhere along the line there was a nonsensical idea purported that velocity increases feom 1300-2000fps dont matter and thats crazy. I also believe if little diameter increases of .023 makes some monumental difference then knocking up the diameter to .7-.8 if ground breaking and have found that to be true especially if a marginal shot is made. I jabe one load that knocks the socks off of 2000+ lb bovines and little animals as well is loads that involve an aframe.

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#198329 - 03/26/19 03:14 PM Re: Cast or expanding for large big game??? [Re: tradmark]
sixshot
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Bullet cost should never factor into an expensive hunt, that's peanuts. Why would you go low ball on a bullet? How many are you going to shoot on a hunt?
If you rely on cast like I do, you absolutely can NOT over drive them, that's what many do not & will not ever understand. Drive them hard onto a hard surface & they will fail, we learned that back in the 70's in handgun Silhouette. When we softened the bullet a bit & slowed them down a bit, the Rams would go over. Run them fast & a hard alloy & the bullets would shatter.
You need tough bullets, not brittle bullets. High antimony cast bullets on bone can break your heart, true story. Will they equal the best jacketed bullets, absolutely not.


Dick

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#198330 - 03/26/19 03:45 PM Re: Cast or expanding for large big game??? [Re: sixshot]
Whitworth
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Registered: 01/15/09
Posts: 9671
Loc: Virginia

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 Originally Posted By: sixshot
Bullet cost should never factor into an expensive hunt, that's peanuts. Why would you go low ball on a bullet? How many are you going to shoot on a hunt?
If you rely on cast like I do, you absolutely can NOT over drive them, that's what many do not & will not ever understand. Drive them hard onto a hard surface & they will fail, we learned that back in the 70's in handgun Silhouette. When we softened the bullet a bit & slowed them down a bit, the Rams would go over. Run them fast & a hard alloy & the bullets would shatter.
You need tough bullets, not brittle bullets. High antimony cast bullets on bone can break your heart, true story. Will they equal the best jacketed bullets, absolutely not.


Dick


Well said, Dick.
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#198332 - 03/26/19 07:11 PM Re: Cast or expanding for large big game??? [Re: sixshot]
tradmark
Gun Slinger


Registered: 06/08/10
Posts: 2999

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 Originally Posted By: sixshot
Bullet cost should never factor into an expensive hunt, that's peanuts. Why would you go low ball on a bullet? How many are you going to shoot on a hunt?
If you rely on cast like I do, you absolutely can NOT over drive them, that's what many do not & will not ever understand. Drive them hard onto a hard surface & they will fail, we learned that back in the 70's in handgun Silhouette. When we softened the bullet a bit & slowed them down a bit, the Rams would go over. Run them fast & a hard alloy & the bullets would shatter.
You need tough bullets, not brittle bullets. High antimony cast bullets on bone can break your heart, true story. Will they equal the best jacketed bullets, absolutely not.


Dick




Very true and the key factor. Well said

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