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#197830 - 02/24/19 09:44 AM 356 Winchester / 358 Winchester
Bob Roach
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Registered: 03/02/10
Posts: 949
Loc: Missouri Ozarks

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I have had a new set of 358 dies in the shop for years. I always planned on having a 358 rifle built, but never did.
In the last year I have added an Encore to my hunting handguns. I now have an action that will stand 356 Winchester ammunition. I also have a CVA Scout that I have had rechambered to 357 Maximum that would also stand the 356 Winchester.

I have been a 35 Caliber fan for years. I have both 357 Maximums and a 35 Bullberry. A 356 Winchester should be a 200 fps improvement over the 35 Bullberry I would think.

I believe SAWFISH may have a 356 handgun from a post on another forum, just wondering what others might have and what they think about the chambering.
Also what parent case works best, 307 Winchester of 444 Marlin?

Bob R
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#197835 - 02/24/19 01:09 PM Re: 356 Winchester / 358 Winchester [Re: Bob Roach]
45MAN
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Registered: 08/13/17
Posts: 1390
Loc: brownsville, texas

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I HAVE A RPM XL IN 356 BUT I SENT ITS FRAME TO JIM ROCK TO GET ANOTHER BARREL FITTED TO IT AND NOW THE 356 DOESN'T QUITE FIT RIGHT. YEARS AGO I SPOKE WITH GARY WRIGLEY, JIM ROCK'S SON-IN-LAW, WHO AT ONE TIME TOOK OVER RPM, AND HE SAID HE CUD FIX THE PROBLEM, BUT I NEVER GOT AROUND TO DOING IT. I LOADED THE 356 WITH THE HORNADY 180gr SSP BULLET TO AROUND 2,400fps AND KILLED A FEW GOOD BUCKS WITH IT. I BELIEVE YOU CAN LOAD HEAVIER FOR THE 356 IN AN ENCORE THAN IN A XL. IF YOU CAN'T FIND 356 BRASS OR AMMO I WUD TRY 307, BUT I ONLY EVER USED 356 BRASS.
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"ADAPT OR DIE". I USE ALL CAPS, NOT BECAUSE I AM YELLING, BUT BECAUSE IT IS AN OLD HABIT FROM MY ARMY DAYS, PLUS IT IS EASIER TO TYPE AND READ.

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#197837 - 02/24/19 03:24 PM Re: 356 Winchester / 358 Winchester [Re: 45MAN]
H2OBUG
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Registered: 02/13/08
Posts: 2129
Loc: Louisiana

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I had a 356 in a rifle and handgun Encore. MGM barrels with Shilen blanks

Both shot really well with the 180gr Speer hot core.
I also used the 180 Hornady SSPB--still have a few.

Killed a pile of critters with the handgun

http://www.handgunhunt.com/photopost/showphoto.php?photo=3590



Edited by H2OBUG (03/01/19 12:17 PM)
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#197839 - 02/24/19 08:30 PM Re: 356 Winchester / 358 Winchester [Re: H2OBUG]
500WE
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Registered: 02/12/07
Posts: 1701
Loc: North Carolina

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Like Rey, I also have an RPM in .356 Win. I use the 180 Speer FN. I have only used .356 cases, and never had to form any from another parent. They are plenty strong. Reforming from .307 Win. should be little problem.

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#197840 - 02/25/19 12:18 AM Re: 356 Winchester / 358 Winchester [Re: 500WE]
Bob Roach
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Registered: 03/02/10
Posts: 949
Loc: Missouri Ozarks

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Looking like the 180 Speer FP is a popular bullet for the 356. I have killed a lot of deer with that bullet in the past fired from a 35 Whelen Rifle.

Bob
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#197841 - 02/25/19 07:45 AM Re: 356 Winchester / 358 Winchester [Re: Bob Roach]
45MAN
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Registered: 08/13/17
Posts: 1390
Loc: brownsville, texas

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ALTHOUGH THE 180 HORNADY SSP's WORKED I THOUGHT THEY WERE TOO FRANGIBLE AT THOSE VELOCITIES. I DO NOT THINK THEY ARE AVAILABLE NOW, BUT IF THEY WERE I WOULD NOT RECOMMEND THEM FOR THE 356.

BTW, I SHOT A SMALL HOG WITH MINE, FROM A REST IN A BLIND, AT 276 YARDS, GREAT SHOT, SICKLY PIG THAT WAS NOT WORTH KEEPING.
_________________________
"ADAPT OR DIE". I USE ALL CAPS, NOT BECAUSE I AM YELLING, BUT BECAUSE IT IS AN OLD HABIT FROM MY ARMY DAYS, PLUS IT IS EASIER TO TYPE AND READ.

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#197843 - 02/25/19 03:20 PM Re: 356 Winchester / 358 Winchester [Re: 45MAN]
Sawfish
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Registered: 02/10/04
Posts: 945
Loc: Peoples Republik of Kalifornia

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My RPM is a .356/.358 Win. It was originally a .358 Win, but I had Jim Rock cut a rim in the chamber to accommodate the rimmed .356 Win. case. I had this done so I could have a rimmed case for my .358 Win. loads. I can change back to ,358 Win by simply changing extractors. Factory .358 Win loads are stouter than the .356 Win. factory loads, in deference to the perceived strength limitations of the Model 94 Win., and the few Marlin 336 and Savage 99 rifles chambered for .356 Winchester. You can load both calibers the same in an Encore or RPM. The RPM XL guns are actually stronger than the Encores by virtue of their design. The large bottom lug of the RPM barrels bears directly on the frame. You can actually fire an RPM XL without the barrel retaining screw for this reason. The strength point is academic because both guns will easily withstand .358 or .356 factory loads. I have fired many rounds through my 30/06 and .35 Whelen Improved Encores with no problems. For what it is worth, I generally use 200 gr. R-P SPCL or Hornady 200 gr. SP bullets in these calibers.
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Patron Member NRA;
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#197845 - 02/26/19 07:22 AM Re: 356 Winchester / 358 Winchester [Re: Sawfish]
45MAN
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Registered: 08/13/17
Posts: 1390
Loc: brownsville, texas

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RE THE RELATIVE STRENGTH OF THE XL vs. THE ENCORE, FACTORY 376 270gr STEYR AMMO WILL LOCK UP A XL BUT NOT AN ENCORE. THE XL MAY BE STRONGER BUT WITH HOT LOADS IT CAN TRULY BECOME A "SINGLE SHOT" UNTIL YOU CAN GET 'ER OPEN AGAIN.
_________________________
"ADAPT OR DIE". I USE ALL CAPS, NOT BECAUSE I AM YELLING, BUT BECAUSE IT IS AN OLD HABIT FROM MY ARMY DAYS, PLUS IT IS EASIER TO TYPE AND READ.

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#197848 - 02/26/19 04:58 PM Re: 356 Winchester / 358 Winchester [Re: 45MAN]
Sawfish
old hand


Registered: 02/10/04
Posts: 945
Loc: Peoples Republik of Kalifornia

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I guess you can tear anything up!
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Good Shooting Makes Good Hunting
Patron Member NRA;
Life Member RMEF, SCI, NSRPA, CRPA: Member, FTRF, HHI #7108, CBA

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#197903 - 03/03/19 08:10 AM Re: 356 Winchester / 358 Winchester [Re: Sawfish]
Bob Roach
old hand


Registered: 03/02/10
Posts: 949
Loc: Missouri Ozarks

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I sent off my order to MGM. I ordered an Encore Barrel, in stainless steel. Length 15.875". Full 1" Bull like my 260 Remington, and 7.62x53R Barrels. Drilled for the 6 screw scope base. I will need to get a six screw Bullberry base on order. I believe I still have an extra Hanger Bar for the Bullberry Forend. I will need to get another HLR 4 Gill Muzzle Brake picked up. I need to get a dummy round or two assembled and sent to MGM to get the Throat optimized.

From my research so far the Hornady 200 grain FTX does not look like a bad choice in bullets for the 356 Win at Handgun Velocity. It is rated as being a little tougher constructed than a 180 SSP, but not as tough as the Speer 180 or Sierra 200 RN. I will need to check this bullet out. I have a box on hand that I got to work with in my 35 Bullberry.
I still have at least a full box of Hornady 180 SSP's on hand. They should give me a bench mark on expansion and penetration when I get to Fackler Water Box Testing.

I have 60 New 356 Win Cases on hand. That should last a very long time hunting. My semi local reloading supply Carters near Willow Springs Missouri has a bag of Winchester 307 on the shelf. I will pick that bag up for my load work up, and bullet testing. Save the 356 brass for use after load development. The 50 used in load development and bullet testing may be a little the worst for wear when I am through.

Bob R
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