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#194011 - 08/19/18 03:56 PM TOO TIGHT CHAMBERS IN MODEL 83's?
45MAN
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I WAS LOADING SOME SWIFT .452 265 BULLETS AND SOME FURY 260 FP FMJ's IN F-A CASES TRIMMED TO 1.375 INCHES. I WAS GETTING SOME LOADS THAT WUD NOT FULLY CHAMBER. TWEAKED THE DIES, RECLEANED THE CYLINDER, AND THE LONG AND SHORT OF IT IS THAT I ENDED UP WITH 2 OF 14 LOADS WITH THE SWIFTS THAT WUD NOT FULLY CHAMBER IN 3 FA MODEL 454's BUT WILL IN 2 OTHERS. I DISCUSSED THIS WITH TRADMARK AND HE SAID HE HAD A SIMILAR PROBLEM AND SENT THE CYLINDER IN TO FA TO HAVE THE CHAMBERS LENGTHENED AND THAT SOLVED THE PROBLEM. WONDERING IF ANY OF YOU HAVE HAD SIMILAR ISSUES WITH CERTAIN BULLETS. ALSO, APPEARS TO BE RANDOM ACROSS THE SERIAL # RANGES.
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#194013 - 08/19/18 04:56 PM Re: TOO TIGHT CHAMBERS IN MODEL 83's? [Re: 45MAN]
45MAN
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I WAS LOADING THE SWIFTS FOR A 12 INCHER, I JUST TRIED HANDLOADS OF THE 320 PUNCH BULLET, THE 325 BARNES, AND THE OLD RN CORBON FMJ AND ALL FIT FINE IN THE 12 INCHER, PLUS SOME WINCHESTER FACTORY AMMO FITS FINE IN THE 12 INCHER. I TRIED THE SWIFT LOADS THAT WERE STICKY OR WUD NOT CHAMBER ALL THE WAY IN DIFFERENT CHAMBERS AND IT IS NOT A PROBLEM ISOLATED TO 1 CHAMBER. SINCE I HAVE A 10 INCHER AND MY PRACTICE 8 3/8ths INCHER THAT THE SWIFT LOADS FIT FINE IN, I THINK I WILL USE THEM AND SAVE THE 12 INCHER FOR OTHER LOADS.


Edited by 45MAN (08/19/18 05:03 PM)
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#194017 - 08/19/18 07:49 PM Re: TOO TIGHT CHAMBERS IN MODEL 83's? [Re: 45MAN]
jamesfromjersey Moderator
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Rey, Put a cannelure on some Speer 300gr DC bullets made for a 50AE and loaded five of them in 500WE cases with Tightgroup for a nice handload capable of taking deer/pigs so my 500WE does not sit in the safe because of heavy kicking loads. Anyway, only two of the five handloads fit in the FA`s chambers... If they ALL were oversized is one thing but two DID fit... Working on it....
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#194018 - 08/19/18 08:41 PM Re: TOO TIGHT CHAMBERS IN MODEL 83's? [Re: jamesfromjersey]
45MAN
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JAMES: WHAT I AM THINKING IS THAT IT DOESN'T TAKE MUCH TO BE A NO-GO SINCE THE FA's ARE TIGHT. HAVE YOU TRIED A DEEPER CANNELURE?
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#194040 - 08/20/18 04:17 PM Re: TOO TIGHT CHAMBERS IN MODEL 83's? [Re: 45MAN]
jamesfromjersey Moderator
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 Originally Posted By: 45MAN
JAMES: HAVE YOU TRIED A DEEPER CANNELURE?



That`s next..
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#194061 - 08/21/18 04:02 PM Re: TOO TIGHT CHAMBERS IN MODEL 83's? [Re: jamesfromjersey]
Sawfish
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Will your loaded rounds fit in a cartridge case gauge?
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#194063 - 08/21/18 06:36 PM Re: TOO TIGHT CHAMBERS IN MODEL 83's? [Re: Sawfish]
cherokeetracker
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The best gauge is the cylinder. Especially in this case.

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#194064 - 08/21/18 07:43 PM Re: TOO TIGHT CHAMBERS IN MODEL 83's? [Re: cherokeetracker]
45MAN
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SOME OF THE ROUNDS WILL NOT FIT IN 3 DIFFERENT FA 454's BUT WILL EASILY FIT IN 2 OTHERS.
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#194071 - 08/22/18 12:40 PM Re: TOO TIGHT CHAMBERS IN MODEL 83's? [Re: 45MAN]
Sawfish
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Rey, You just have too many FA 454s. Pack up the three offending guns and send them to me. That will solve your ammo problems. Thanks.
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#194111 - 08/26/18 06:35 AM Re: TOO TIGHT CHAMBERS IN MODEL 83's? [Re: Sawfish]
OFFSHORE
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 Originally Posted By: Sawfish
Rey, You just have too many FA 454s. Pack up the three offending guns and send them to me. That will solve your ammo problems. Thanks.


I don't believe Sawfish needs to get all three. . .I would like one as well - LOL!

Is it all the same particular load or is it just one particular round that is giving you such problems and is this the first time your shooting this FA 454? If it is with any loads you put in those cylinders I would ship it back to FA or order a Cylinder Throat Reamer from Brownells.

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#194139 - 08/27/18 04:01 PM Re: TOO TIGHT CHAMBERS IN MODEL 83's? [Re: OFFSHORE]
Sawfish
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[quote=OFFSHOREI don't believe Sawfish needs to get all three. . .I would like one as well - LOL![/quote]

Since when does Handgun Hunting have anything to do with "need"?
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#194180 - 09/01/18 02:54 PM Re: TOO TIGHT CHAMBERS IN MODEL 83's? [Re: Sawfish]
BBwheelgunner
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Interesting let us know what you find out. have you measured the bullets? is it possible that they are over sized and thus bulge the case too much?
Just a thought
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#194288 - 09/09/18 07:26 PM Re: TOO TIGHT CHAMBERS IN MODEL 83's? [Re: OFFSHORE]
45MAN
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I HAVE BEEN HAVING TROUBLE WITH THE SWIFTS AND THE CUSTOM FURY BULLETS. I HAVE BELLED THE CASE MOUTH AS MUCH AS I CAN AND STILL GET IT IN THE 454 SEATER DIE. WITH SOME OLD FREEDOM ARMS CASULL BRASS IT SEEMED LIKE SOME CASE WALLS WERE ARE TOO THICK WHICH CAUSES 1 OR BOTH OF 2 PROBLEMS, #1 IS THAT SOMETIMES THE BULLETS WON'T SEAT, AND #2 IS THAT SOMETIMES THEY DO NOT CHAMBER. I GOT SOME NEW STARLINE 454 BRASS AND I HAVE THE SAME PROBLEM. I HAVE SOME WIN 454 BRASS AND IT SEEMS TO BE MORE FORGIVING. THE SWIFT AND THE FURY HAVE THICK JACKETS AND HARD CORES IN COMMON (NO GIVE IN THESE .452 BULLETS. I LOADED SOME .451 BARNES BUSTERS IN FREEDOM ARMS BRASS WITHOUT ANY PROBLEMS. IN 2009 I LOADED SOME .452 PUNCH BULLETS IN FREEDOM ARMS CASULL BRASS WITHOUT ISSUES (BUT THE PUNCH BULLETS ARE BRASS I BELIEVE AND DO NOT GALL IN A TIGHT CASE AS DO THE SWIFTS AND THE FURY's DO ON OCCASION). THE MYSTERIES OF RELOADING. I AM RUNNING OUT OF TIME BEFORE DEER SEASON AND AM GOING TO DROP THE HV SWIFT PROJECT FOR NOW. I HAVE SOME OLDER WINCHESTER 300gr (LOOKS LIKE A FA BULLET) AMMO, THAT I HAVE SIGHTED IN A 12 INCHER FOR.
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#194298 - 09/10/18 04:13 PM Re: TOO TIGHT CHAMBERS IN MODEL 83's? [Re: 45MAN]
BBwheelgunner
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I was experiencing a similar situation with loading the Swift 265 A-Frames a couple years ago. No matter what I did, the were seating difficult and would even shave off some copper from the outside of the bullet that would be visible in the canalure and sometimes almost "ribbon" out the case mouth. same thing, I tried belling the case more and more and it still did it. A lot of those were with Starline brass I believe, but had the issue with some others as well.

I talked to a Swift Tech and he tried a number of different case brands and had the same thing happen but told me it shouldn't be a big deal. still seemed weird to me, why would it do that unless the bullets were oversized? a mystery indeed!
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#194299 - 09/10/18 06:26 PM Re: TOO TIGHT CHAMBERS IN MODEL 83's? [Re: BBwheelgunner]
45MAN
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THOSE SWIFTS ARE OVER A BUCK A BULLET SO I NEED TO FIND SOMETHING TO SHOOT THEM IN. WILL TRY SOME HOT 45 COLT LOADS. I HAVE A LOT OF DIFFERENT 45 COLT BRASS TO TRY THEM IN.
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#194305 - 09/11/18 03:20 PM Re: TOO TIGHT CHAMBERS IN MODEL 83's? [Re: 45MAN]
Sawfish
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I had the same problem, but could not figure out what I was doing wrong. Rey, let us know which 45 Colt brass works the best.
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#194306 - 09/11/18 05:50 PM Re: TOO TIGHT CHAMBERS IN MODEL 83's? [Re: Sawfish]
45MAN
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BB AND SAWFISH: I AM THINKING THERE IS AN ISSUE WITH THE SWIFT BULLETS' SIZE OR JACKET MATERIAL THAT IS NOW "COMING TO LIGHT". I DID 9 OF MY 11 AFRICAN SAFARIS USING FA CASULLS BUT WITH A 45 COLT CYLINDER. I LOADED THE 45 COLTS TO 454 EQUIVALENT LEVELS UNSING UNFIRED WW BRASS. THE FA 45 COLT CHAMBERS ARE NOT TIGHT SO THE ONCE FIRED CASES WERE USED FOR PRACTICE ROUNDS AND ALSO USED IN OTHER REVOLVERS. IT WAS IMPOSSIBLE TO RESIZE THEM TO FIT IN MY TIGHT LINEBAUGH REDHAWK OR AN EVEN TIGHTER JRH RUGER BISLEY. FORTUNEATELY I HAVE A LOT OF UNFIRED WW, TOP BRASS AND STARLINE (PLAIN AND NICKELED) BRASS. FIRST I THINK I WILL TRY THE WW BRASS FOR USE IN A FA 45 COLT CYLINDER, SHUD BE ABLE TO GET 1,700fps WITH THAT COMBO. 1 CAVEAT THOUGH: I DO NOT KNOW WHEN I WILL HAVE TIME TO GET TO THIS PROJECT.
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#194313 - 09/11/18 10:37 PM Re: TOO TIGHT CHAMBERS IN MODEL 83's? [Re: 45MAN]
BBwheelgunner
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I know what you mean, that magical time of year has snuck up on us!

Let us know what you find out whenever you get time to do it!

PS,
That is interesting that three of us have experienced that when loading the Swifts... I thought I was going crazy or didn't know what the hell I was doing HA!
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#194317 - 09/11/18 11:59 PM Re: TOO TIGHT CHAMBERS IN MODEL 83's? [Re: BBwheelgunner]
tradmark
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Strange stuff. Ive had one freedom arms 454 that was very tight and picky as to what it would chamber. Had them open it up a touch. Its stiff the most accurate revolver i own. I wonder if swift has some variance in their bullets or something but outside that one gun and it did it with several bullets, ive never had any of these issues with swifts and i shoot a few thousand a year so i dunno but itd be good to get to the bottom of it. Rey, bring that 12? gun to hondo and ill bring my 265 and 325 gr loads that chamber in all my 454?s (11) and lets see if theres a variance.

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#194320 - 09/12/18 06:11 AM Re: TOO TIGHT CHAMBERS IN MODEL 83's? [Re: tradmark]
45MAN
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I HAD A SMART IDEA LAST NIGHT, I SPRAYED THE BARNES WITH THE HORNADY CASE LUBE. FIRST TRY IN A *- CASE AND SAME PROBLEM, I CUDN'T GET IT TO SEAT. FOR SOME REASON THE SWIFT JACKET GALLS AND GETS STUCK IN THICKER WALLED CASES.
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#194335 - 09/12/18 08:58 PM Re: TOO TIGHT CHAMBERS IN MODEL 83's? [Re: 45MAN]
BBwheelgunner
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Yeah with my experience with the jacket galling or binding being said, regardless The 265gr Swifts so far have been the most accurate rounds I have put through my FA.

It made me feel better that the fella at Swift was experiencing the same thing knowing it wasn't just me.

I did also seem to have better luck with Winchester brass and have since mostly been shooting all new Winchester brass for my hot hunting loads
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#194343 - 09/13/18 09:31 AM Re: TOO TIGHT CHAMBERS IN MODEL 83's? [Re: BBwheelgunner]
junebug
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I hate to ask such an obvious question but have any of you ever miked these bullets . Are they in specs,out of round,or just long for caliber and have to be seated deep?
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#194344 - 09/13/18 01:15 PM Re: TOO TIGHT CHAMBERS IN MODEL 83's? [Re: junebug]
45MAN
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I MIKED SOME AND THEY WERE OK. THE PROBLEM IS THAT THE JACKET MATERIAL THEY R MADE OF GALLS/CATCHES ON THE THICKER WALLED 454 CASES. THEY SEEM TO DO BETTER OR ARE OK WITH THINNER WALLED BRASS. TRADMARK USES FEDERAL 454 BRASS AND SAYS THEY WORK OK. SOME WINCHESTER BRASS I HAVE SEEMS TO BE OK.
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#194345 - 09/13/18 02:36 PM Re: TOO TIGHT CHAMBERS IN MODEL 83's? [Re: 45MAN]
Seminole Wind
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I too hate to ask an obvious question, but are you chamfering the inside of the case mouth? My Swift Aframe/ Starline components have never caused a problem, with .454 Casull, .45 Colt and .44 mag.

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#194347 - 09/13/18 05:08 PM Re: TOO TIGHT CHAMBERS IN MODEL 83's? [Re: Seminole Wind]
Chance Weldon Administrator
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 Originally Posted By: Seminole Wind
I too late to ask an obvious question, but are you chamfering the inside of the case mouth?


X2
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#194350 - 09/13/18 07:48 PM Re: TOO TIGHT CHAMBERS IN MODEL 83's? [Re: Chance Weldon]
45MAN
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YES, I HAVE CHAMFERED THE INSIDE OF THE CASE MOUTH. DO NOT KNOW WHAT THE PROBLEM IS FOR SURE BUT OTHERS HAVE HAD SIMILAR PROBLEMS.
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#194353 - 09/13/18 09:33 PM Re: TOO TIGHT CHAMBERS IN MODEL 83's? [Re: Chance Weldon]
BBwheelgunner
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 Originally Posted By: Chance Weldon
 Originally Posted By: Seminole Wind
I too late to ask an obvious question, but are you chamfering the inside of the case mouth?


X2


Its been a while since I loaded any A-Frames, but yes I did chamfer, and bell the case mouth (which realy should make the chamfering a moot point I would think). Like 45man said, I played with the amount of bell I put on too, starting with very little and trying more than I would normally use. even tried one of the lyman VLD chamfer tools to try something different
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#194355 - 09/13/18 10:24 PM Re: TOO TIGHT CHAMBERS IN MODEL 83's? [Re: BBwheelgunner]
sw282
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Chambers in my 460S&W are tight. Hornady 460 die set includes a

taper crimp die. lts use sometime helps with problem loaded rds

that want to stick in chambers. 45ACP taper crimp die works too.

Just be careful not to bulge the case above the rim

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#194364 - 09/14/18 05:04 PM Re: TOO TIGHT CHAMBERS IN MODEL 83's? [Re: sw282]
45MAN
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I GOT AN IDEA, I AM GOING TO TAKE NEW STARLINE 454 CASES, TRIM TO 1.375, CHAMFER INSIDE AND OUT, SIZE, BELL AND CHAMFER AGAIN. MAYBE THE BOTTOM OF THE BELL IS WHERE THE BULLETS ARE HANGING UP. WILL EVEN TRY A VLD CHAMFER TOOL. EVEN IF I CAN GET THEM TO SEAT, WILL THEY CHAMBER IN ALL MY FA 454's OR ONLY THE "LOOSER" 2? WHAT THE HELL, LET ME MAYBE SACRIFICE A FEW MORE $1.08 EACH BULLETS TO FIND OUT.
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#194393 - 09/15/18 12:28 PM Re: TOO TIGHT CHAMBERS IN MODEL 83's? [Re: 45MAN]
45MAN
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 Originally Posted By: 45MAN
I GOT AN IDEA, I AM GOING TO TAKE NEW STARLINE 454 CASES, TRIM TO 1.375, CHAMFER INSIDE AND OUT, SIZE, BELL AND CHAMFER AGAIN. MAYBE THE BOTTOM OF THE BELL IS WHERE THE BULLETS ARE HANGING UP. WILL EVEN TRY A VLD CHAMFER TOOL. EVEN IF I CAN GET THEM TO SEAT, WILL THEY CHAMBER IN ALL MY FA 454's OR ONLY THE "LOOSER" 2? WHAT THE HELL, LET ME MAYBE SACRIFICE A FEW MORE $1.08 EACH BULLETS TO FIND OUT.


WELL I TRIED THE ABOVE USING A RCBS VLD CHAMFER TOOL AND BINGO! SEATED 5 265gr SWIFTS IN STAR LINE CASES WITHOUT ANY PROBLEMS AND ALL 5 CHAMBERED EASILY IN A TIGHT 12 INCH 454.
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#194397 - 09/15/18 02:24 PM Re: TOO TIGHT CHAMBERS IN MODEL 83's? [Re: 45MAN]
BBwheelgunner
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Nice! so you think the belling step was maybe marring the inside of the case just enough to cause the bullet to bind?
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#194402 - 09/15/18 05:06 PM Re: TOO TIGHT CHAMBERS IN MODEL 83's? [Re: BBwheelgunner]
45MAN
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 Originally Posted By: BBwheelgunner
Nice! so you think the belling step was maybe marring the inside of the case just enough to cause the bullet to bind?


LOOKS LIKE THE BELLING CAUSED ENUFF OF A CONSTRICTION (AT THE BOTTOM OF THE BELL, THAT THE SWIFT BULLETS CUDN'T HANDLE. A LITTLE POST BELLING CHAMFERING WITH A VLD CHAMFER SEEMS TO DO THE TRICK.
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#194428 - 09/18/18 12:07 AM Re: TOO TIGHT CHAMBERS IN MODEL 83's? [Re: 45MAN]
tradmark
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Wow. Very very interesting and great job figuring it out rey!!!!

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#194614 - 09/29/18 12:43 AM Re: TOO TIGHT CHAMBERS IN MODEL 83's? [Re: tradmark]
BBwheelgunner
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I just ordered a box of 300gr Swifts and they have been loading nicely so far. I only had one out of about 25 that took more force than it should have to seat. the rest all seated just fine. this box of 300 grainers seems more uniform to the eye also than some of the 265s I had a few years ago.

Loaded these with a good dose of WW296... we'll see how they shoot tomorrow
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#194616 - 09/29/18 07:32 AM Re: TOO TIGHT CHAMBERS IN MODEL 83's? [Re: BBwheelgunner]
45MAN
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BBwheelgunner: WHAT BRASS ARE YOU USING AND DID YOU DO ANY SPECIAL CASE PREP?
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#194617 - 09/29/18 12:35 PM Re: TOO TIGHT CHAMBERS IN MODEL 83's? [Re: 45MAN]
BBwheelgunner
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New Winchester Brass.
That is one of the reasons I started using Winchester Brass, I seemed to have fewer issues with the Swift Bullets.

I didn't do any special prep, just the normal belling the case mouth. I did try Tradmark's "454 crimp" process with these, but other than that same stuff.

For what ever reason, I definitely had more issues with the 265s, especially when I was using Starline nickel plated brass.


Edited by BBwheelgunner (09/29/18 12:39 PM)
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Classic .22 Handguns by Colt and Smith & Wesson

Kudu Dreaming
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